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Special thanks to Rodrigo Gimenez (rge@adinet.com.uy) for providing these many posting resources regarding Nikon focusing screens and the related Nikon Finders pages!!!...

Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 
From: Mark Walberg Walberg@simmons.swmed.edu
To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing screens types C and M

From: Mark Walberg Walberg@simmons.swmed.edu

The cross hair on the C screen (don't know about the M, but I think it is
similar) is on clear (not ground) glass.  This is used for parallax
focusing.  This will work better with the high mag finder or the DG2 type
magnifier, but I think it would work with the regular finders, too - just
not as well.

   Parallax focusing works like this:  Recall that what ever is in focus on
the film is also in focus on the screen.  If a subject is in focus on the
screen, then it will remain stationary relative to the cross hair when you
move your point of view.  You move your point of view by moving your head
side to side.  If, however, the image is a bit out of focus at the screen
plane, when you move your head side to side the image will move relative to
the cross hair. You can get very accurate focus this way.  It is most
useful with macro of subjects without nice high contrast lines that would
make it otherwise easy to focus.

-Mark Walberg

>From: Rodrigo Gimenez rge@adinet.com.uy
>I would like to know how the focusing screens types C and M
>works, referring to the cross-hair reticle that they have in
>the middle.
>Type C can be focused in the matte area only, but I don't know
>about the type M since it has a fresnel only, I think that is for
>viewing only, not for focus or depth of field.
>I also would like to know if the cross-hair reticle must be used
>with a waist level finder or a 6x high magnification finder.



Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999
To: NikonMF@onelist.com
From: Dag Altin Dag.Altin@chem.sintef.no
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing screens types C and M

From: Dag Altin Dag.Altin@chem.sintef.no

>From: Rodrigo Gimenez rge@adinet.com.uy

Hello Rodrigo!
(SNIP)
>I would like to know how the focusing screens types C and M
>works, referring to the cross-hair reticle that they have in 
>the middle.
>Type C can be focused in the matte area only, but I don't know 
>about the type M since it has a fresnel only, I think that is for 
>viewing only, not for focus or depth of field.
(SNIP)

Of the two I have used only the M-screen on a regular basis for macro work.
I find it a bit hard to focus, so I nearly always do check the film to
subject distance with a ruler during setup. It's very bright so it works
better with slower lenses in low light than the split-prism screens (P&K;),
but if the light is sufficient I prefer the split-prism screens over the
M-screen.

(SNIP)

>I also would like to know if the cross-hair reticle must be used 
>with a waist level finder or a 6x high magnification finder.
(SNIP)

No, not necessarily. I use those two finders with the most convenient
screen for the specific task to be solved. Mostly depending on how good the
light and how cooperative the "model" is. Actually these two finders work
well with the split-prism screens since you get a good magnification of the
split area, but you will need a fast lens to avoid "blackening" of the
split area. Hope this answers your questions to some extent, and most

hopefully others will fill in with their experience. 

Best regards
Dag Altin, Norway.



Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 08:40:40 -0700
From: Godfrey DiGiorgi 
To: "NikonMF" 
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing screens types C and M

From: Godfrey DiGiorgi 

Two very specialized focusing screens. Both these screens require precise 
focusing at the eyepiece for best results so the 6x magnifying viewfinder 
is the right way to go, or a DR-3/DR-4 on a prism finder. 
The C is designed for astrophotography and maximum brightness: you focus 
the cross-hair very finely and then use it to keep your eye focused on 
the aerial image plane while you adjust the lens or telescope.

The M is designed for photomicroscopy. When imaging at magnification 
significantly greater than 1:1, the depth of field is shallower than the 
depth of focus ... you have to use some optical effects to determine the 
center point of the depth of focus. Again, you focus critically on the 
double-crosshair. As you rack in your subject, you shift your eye a 
little as you watch the image and adjust the microscope. There comes a 
moment where a point in your subject plane will tend to "dance" in a 
unique way across the double-crosshair. That's when you know you're at 
the focus centerpoint, the sharpest point of focus. 

Godfrey

>I would like to know how the focusing screens types C and M
>works, referring to the cross-hair reticle that they have in 
>the middle.
>Type C can be focused in the matte area only, but I don't know 
>about the type M since it has a fresnel only, I think that is for 
>viewing only, not for focus or depth of field.
>
>I also would like to know if the cross-hair reticle must be used 
>with a waist level finder or a 6x high magnification finder.



Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999
From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net
To: "NikonMF" NikonMF@onelist.com
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing screens types C and M

From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net

>I supposed that the types C and D aren't for maximum brightness, since 
>they are the only screens that don't have a fresnel lens (matte screens).
>Are they brighter than type B focusing screen (matte/fresnel screen)?
>Or when you say maximum brightness you are referring to the center only?

The use of these screens is very specialized. I've never done a 
comparative study of the brightness of these screens compared to the 
general purpose B screens. I've never used the C screen, and only looked 
through a camera fitted with a D screen once with a 1200mm f/16 lens 
mounted. 

>1)Why the double cross-hair has a fresnel field and the cross hair has 
>  a matte field.

Because these focusing screens were designed for very specialized 
purposes which Nikon felt were best implemented with different designs.

>2)How the type C performs with photomicroscopy and how the type M
>  performs with astrophotography? (I read on brochures that both
>  C and M are for photomicroscopy and astrophotography, but brochures 
>  aren't always  precise).


I've only used an M screen a couple of times for some photomicroscopy and 
never a C screen. The M screen worked extremely well for its intended 
purpose.

>3)I didn't think about the depth of field being shallower than the 
>  depth of focus before, is it really possible?

Yes, please go to a book on optics and macro-/micro-photography for 
in-depth explanations. I'd likely muck up the explanations too badly off 
the top of my head and they're written up well in reference texts.

Godfrey



Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999
From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net
To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing screen type M

From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net

The M screen is designed for use in circumstances when you have almost
literally no depth of field (or aperture mechanism, like when
photographing through a microscope). So it's mostly clear fresnel field. 

Godfrey

On Fri, 24 Sep 1999, Rodrigo Gimenez wrote:

> From: Rodrigo Gimenez 
> 
> Can you chech focusing or depth of field with the type M screen, or 
> only the fresnel is for clear viewing?
> I read that with the type C screen you can focus outside the cross-hair
> reticle and then fine focus with the cross-hair reticle, but I suppose 
> that with the type M is different.



Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999
From: Mark Walberg Walberg@simmons.swmed.edu
To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing screens types C and M

From: Mark Walberg Walberg@simmons.swmed.edu

Rodrigo Gimenez  asked, regarding parallax focusing:

>Does the object must be in the small circle in the middle where moving my
>head?

Well yes, I think it does have to be near the middle.  This is because you
have to have your subject and the cross hair close to each other to see
whether thay are moving relative to one another.

  Maybe the additional lines on the M screen can help with this, but I
haven't used it.

-Mark Walberg



Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999
From: Mark Walberg Walberg@simmons.swmed.edu
To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] D screen

From: Mark Walberg Walberg@simmons.swmed.edu

The D screen is just a ground glass.  It is a small version of looking at
the ground glass of your 4x5 without any fresnel lens.  If you've done
that, you'll be familiar with the dark corners.  The wider the lens, the
darker the corners.  So, the D isn't great for those wide lenses.  It is,
however very good with the longer lenses.  It is very definitely not as
bright as the screens with the fresnels.  But, you can get more accurate
focus with a D screen.  For many uses, very accurate focus isn't so
important.  But, when it is, the D is helpful.  The reason for this is that
the image is being focused on a very thin plane of the groung glass
surface.  When you start adding a fresnel or prisms, or if you make the
screen surface coarser, then the focusing plane on the screen becomes
thicker.  That alone makes it harder to get the focus just right.  The D
won't be your favorite if you're doing low light candids or concerts, etc
(but then again, maybe you should be using a rangefinder for that anyway  -

personal opinion only  ;< )        )

However, if you are doing pictures with limited depth of field where the
placement of the plane of focus is important, you just might like it  -
unless you are using wideangle lenses.  Once you get used to it, it is
actually easier to focus in spite of its being darker.
-Mark Walberg

Rodrigo Gimenez asked about the D screen:

>I suppossed that the types C and D aren't for maximum brightness, since
>they are the only screens that don't have a fresnel lens (matte screens).

>Are they brighter than type B focusing screen (matte/fresnel screen)?



Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999
From: Mark Walberg Walberg@simmons.swmed.edu
To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] D screen

From: Mark Walberg Walberg@simmons.swmed.edu

>From: Rodrigo Gimenez rge@adinet.com.uy
>It remembers me the fact that the type U screen for telephotos
>has black corners with wide angles, so I think that it has a
>fresnel less strong than the type B screen, which doesn't has black
>corners with wide angles.
>But the surprise is that type U is brighter than type B, while type D
>is darker than type B, that may be because the matte treatment of type B
>and D are different.

Well. I've not seen a U, but as far as I can tell from what I read, the
only difference between B and U is the focal length of the fresnel lens.
Maybe U seems brighter on telephotos because it focuses more of the light
into the eye, while B has to spread the light out more so that it will work
with wide angles.

  Recall that D has no fresnel at all.  B is basically D with a fresnel
lens added.  The purpose of the fresnel lens is to brighten the image,
especially in the corners.  So, it is certainly expected that D will be
darker than B.     The word matte just refers to the ground glass surface.

I don't know if the fineness/coarseness of the grind is any different
between B and D.


>Does it include focusing screens types G and H? They have fresnel and prisms,
>I read that they are easy to focus and very bright.

It is important to distinguish between brightness of the screen and the
ability of the screen to yield accurate focus.  These two qualities are
essentially opposing qualities.  To get the most accurate focus, you need
the flattest possible, finest ground matte surface you can get.
Unfortunately, this will generally not provide a very bright screen.  The
coarser the matte, the brighter the screen image will be (usually).  The
finer the matte grind, the darker the image will be, but the more accurate
the focus will be.  As soon as you start adding anything at all that makles
the screen brighter (such as coarser grind, fresnel lenses, microprisms,
etc.) this makes the screen surface thicker.  As the screen surface gets
thicker, it becomes increasingly difficult to get the image precisely and
accurately focused onto a single plane.  As far as accurate focusing goes,
the ideal screen would have no thickness at all (of course, that is not
possible).

  So, yes, G and H will provide less accurate focus than D, even though G
and H will be considerably easier to see.

-Mark Walberg



Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999
From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net
To: "NikonMF" NikonMF@onelist.com
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing screen type T for the Nikon F3

From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net

Ok, Rodrigo, admit it: You're writing a comprehensive manual on focusing 
screens, their history and purpose, amusing anecdotes, etc... ;)

I never quite understood why I'd need the television standard proportions 
marked on a focusing screen, but Nikon produced the screen as a 
convenience to photographers shooting stuff for TV, I guess. I presume it 
isn't available for the later cameras because few bought it.

Godfrey

>From: Rodrigo Gimenez 
>
>Type T: For TV shots. Maybe TV photographs are made in a very different 
>        way today, I don't know.
>
>Why the focusing screen type T is in the Nikon F3 list of accessories 
>but not in the F4 and F5 lines?
>Is the TV working on a different way today?



Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999
To: NikonMF@onelist.com
From: Dag Altin Dag.Altin@chem.sintef.no
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing screen type T for the Nikon F3

From: Dag Altin Dag.Altin@chem.sintef.no

you wrote:
>From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net
>
>Ok, Rodrigo, admit it: You're writing a comprehensive manual on focusing 
>screens, their history and purpose, amusing anecdotes, etc... ;)
>
(snip)
>Godfrey
>
...cool, THAT'S about time.. count me in for one ex. please... ;-D

Hm, by the way - I think the need for T(V)-screen died by the age of
digital manipulation; digital cropping of pictures today are far easier
than at the intro of the F-3. But.. Yess! (ehem, sorry for that) How
different is the proportions of the croplines at the T-screen and a normal
computer monitor..   

Dag Altin - Norway



Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999
From: Oliver Reddaway oliver@research.canon.com.au
To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing screen type T for the Nikon F3

From: Oliver Reddaway oliver@research.canon.com.au

Hi 

The Type "T" screen has a frame line set in from the edge of the screen showing 
the area of the image that will be displayed on a TV Screen. It is necessary 
because of the diffferent H/V ratios between the 35mm frame and the TV Screen.

Rgds.,

Oliver.

Oliver Reddaway  |  Principal PCB Designer   |   oliver@research.canon.com.au
Canon Information Systems Research Australia Pty Ltd | Phone +61-(0)2-9805-2933
PO Box 313, 1 Thomas Holt Drive,                     | Fax   +61-(0)2-9805-2929
NORTH RYDE, NSW, 2113, AUSTRALIA                     | Mobile +61-(0)414-991318



From: Arthur Laurent ALaurent@npr.org
To: "'NikonMF@onelist.com'" NikonMF@onelist.com
Cc: Arthur Laurent ALaurent@NPR-01-MSG.NPR.ORG
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999
Subject: [NikonMF] Focus screens type T

From: Arthur Laurent ALaurent@npr.org

Godfrey said,

<...I never quite understood why I'd need the television standard
proportions marked on a focusing screen, but Nikon produced the screen as a 
convenience to photographers shooting stuff for TV, I guess...


Those lines are supposed to mark the "safe areas" of television
transmission.  The "safe areas" were those parts of the transmitted
fields/screen that just about any old cheap overscanned tv was supposed to
be able to see.

Way back in the good ol' days, when the screen was made, tv station IDs and
other still graphics (like the famous "technical difficulties" and
resolution-checking test patterns) were often projected from slides.  So a
photographer would copy some graphic artist's creation onto black-and-white
or (later) color reversal film, and that would be projected through the
telecine chain (which also allowed 16 and 35 mm movies to be shown).

Back in the early 80s, (or was it the late 70s?) frame store and other
digital storage schemes largely replaced slides for "non-motion" IDs.  In a
few years, as digital storage became cheaper, non-videotape "motion ID's"
were all the rage during human-switched top-of-the-hour break sequences.

<...I presume it isn't available for the later cameras because few bought it...

I think it's more because technology superseded the need for such a screen.

Art



Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 
From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net
To: "NikonMF" NikonMF@onelist.com
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focus screens type T

From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net

Interesting! Thanks for the info. 

Godfrey



Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999
From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net
To: "NikonMF" NikonMF@onelist.com
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Screen Question

From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net

Focusing screens have an extremely fragile surface. Once out of the 
camera, use a blower and a very fine, dust free sable brush to try to 
remove any dirt particles. Don't use a lens cloth, tissue or any 
solvents. 

A few specks on the screen is par for the course with an SLR that gets 
used a lot. I occasionally take my F3 prism/screen apart and just lightly 
blow them off with a squeeze bulb blower. And live with a dust spec or 
two. 

Godfrey



Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999
From: Mark Walberg Walberg@simmons.swmed.edu
Subject: Re: Focusing Screen type U
To: Rodrigo Gimenez rge@adinet.com.uy

Hello Rodrigo, 

I haven't seen the U myself.  However, my F3 pamphlet lists the B and U as
being the same, except that they are optimized for different focal lenths
as you mentioned.  Only one screen picture is shown for B and U,
suggesting that they are very similar.  In the picture, the fresnel lines
go in circles around the center (as for all fresnel lenses that I've
seen).  The matte is only a ground glass surface.  Again, I'm fairly
certain that a B and U are just D screens with fresnel lenses added.

Again, my understanding has always been that the difference between them is
the focal length of the fresnel lens, with no other differences.   It is,
however, possible that there is some other difference in the way the matte
-ground glass surface is ground for the different screens, although I've
never heard of that before.  As far as I understand, the Beattie screens
are brighter than the Nikon screens because they have a considerably
coarser grind of the matte-ground glass surface.  Again, although this
makes the screen brighter, it makes it harder to get the most accurate
focus.  So, it depends on how you want to use your camera.

   Many years ago, I was thinking of buying a screen for use in closup work
(between 1/2 X and 5X) and  and was having trouble figuring out what screen
would be best for my use.  I called Nikon US to see if I could get more
information from them.  The best they could do was to send me the F3 or 4
brochure, which has the pictures of each screen with minimal information
about each one.  I've never found any good source of detailed information
about the screens.

     I use B and E for most everything.  I use D now and then, and C once
in a very long while.  I use an A when I can't find a B or E.   All that
junk in the middle of the K or J is really distracting to me, so I don't
use them.   I have one screen that is marked T, but has the pattern of an
E.   I'd like to try out an H2 just to see how well I could use it for low
light candids, but I really prefer using my M3 for that anyway.

-Mark

>Hi Mark,
>I sent an email to Michael moersh1597@lineone.net, a photographer
>I met surfing the Internet, he wrote the following about type U
>focusing screen, what do you think?
>
>>The two screens you mention are very similar but the U is optimised
>>for lenses of 100mm or more. The reason is that the grain in the matte
>>field glass has a different grain running circular in the B and quadrant
>>in the U, the grain goes circular towards the corners. This means that
>>the vertical and horizontal axis is clear and gives a brighter view and
>>good corner resolution especially with higher magnification work.
>>The problem is if there is too much light coming in which can cause
>>glare in the screen. The B will give better contrast.



From: "Curfman, Donald (GEIS)" Donald.Curfman@geis.ge.com
To: nikon@MailingList.net
Subject: [NIKON] RE: Focusing screen for use with telescope
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999

> I am using an F2 attached to a Meade ETX telescope for
> photographing the moon (and maybe planets). I find the
> standard A screen hard to focus. Has anyone got a
> recommendation for something better? Thanks.

The C is the best, but you need a 6x finder to use it, 
because it's fine-ground.  You have to be able to focus 
the finder on the screen to get the parallax right.

If you don't have the 6x finder, the D is your best bet.
It's finer than a B screen but it's still got enough
of a matte surface that it'll focus with a standard 
finder.


-Don



From: "James Norris" jnorris@metronet.com
To: "nikon-list" nikon@MailingList.net
Subject: [NIKON] Re: focusing screens for F3
Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 

>>>
Date: Sat, 4 Dec 1999
From: Pentti Juhani_Parnane pparnane@cc.hut.fi
Subject: [NIKON] focusing screens for F3

I've been searching for information about different focusing screens which
can be used on F3. Problem isn't that I haven't found any information, I
have, and too much. In someone's opinion Beatties are the best ones,
somebody disagrees and says that...

I do mostly close-ups with 55mm and 105mm f/2.8 Micro-Nikkors, and
landscapes too. For these situations I want to take wildlife shots I have
a Nikkor 300mm/4.5 if-ed. It's the lens for me, but my F3's standard
K-screen "red dot -model" is too dark and grainy sometimes. If I had a
"better" screen, it would be easier to focus with other lenses too, I
think. Does someone have an idea (not very expensive one) how to get "as
bright viewfinder image as my friend's F100 has"?

How about F4's screens? If I can use them and still get sharp close-up
photos, ( _IF_ they are better than F3's) I'd be able to get a secondhand
one without paying too much.

<<<
I use the E screen on both the F3 and the N90s.  I can't say that there is
much difference in brightness.

The F4 screens will fit the F3, and they are a little brighter.  You might
find an H or a G screeen to be brighter yet.

Jim



From: "Paul Wilson" pauldwilson@ne.mediaone.net
To: nikon@MailingList.net
Subject: RE: [NIKON] Re: focusing screens for F3
Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1999

> Last first. You can't use F4 screens in your F3. Physically, they
> won't fit.
> Both Birghtscreen and Intenscreen (see  http://www.brightscreen.com &
> http://www.intenscreen.com/) make aftermarket screens for your camera.
> While they DO brighten the finder image some people find they do
> so at the
> expense of finder contrast. The human eye relies on its perception of
> contrast as a major component in judging sharpness, so for some a
> brighter
> screen reduces the likelihood of a sharper image.

Henry, you more than anyone has the facilities to try this.  F4 screens do
fit in the F3.  They don't fit as well as the could since the frames are
slightly different.  However, if you take the actual screen out of the frame
and put it in an F3 frame, you'll find it fits perfectly.  I know since I've
done it.

I agree with you on finder contrast though.  I went back to an F3 screen for
this reason.

Paul Wilson

http://people.ne.mediaone.net/pauldwilson



To: "NikonMF list" NikonMF@onelist.com
Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2000
From: "Roger Herzler" rherzler@cts.com
Subject: [NikonMF] astrophotography and focusing screens

From: "Roger Herzler" rherzler@cts.com

I got my pics back from last Thursday's lunar eclipse (up to the website
soon) and I need to get my focusing straight.  Its my impression that the
stock focusing screen on a FM2N isn't bright enough for this kind of work.
It was difficult to tell when I was in focus and out.

What focusing screen to others use in a situation like this?  I'm looking
for a bright screen, but I need to be able to use it for terrestrial use as
well.  Recommendations?

Thanks,
Roger
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
R o g e r  H e r z l e r
"Imagine if we were all on the same sheet of music...
What a symphony it would be." 

mailto:rherzler@cts.com
herzlers hideout: http://herzler.com
the @stro pages: http://theastropages.com ~ enter the @stro contest!
diegotek web solutions: http://diegotek.com



To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2000
From: "Roger Herzler" rherzler@cts.com

Subject: Re: [NikonMF] astrophotography and focusing screens

From: "Roger Herzler" rherzler@cts.com

>      You are dealing with an object approximately 200,000 miles away. What
is there to focus?  Just set your lens to infinity!!  If it is out of focus
on infinity, the problem is with your camera or lens.

I should have clarified on this one.  I'm not using a lens on the camera.
The camera is hooked up via T-mount to a Meade Tele-extender and I'm using
eyepiece projection through my telescope, which means that I have to focus
the image at the eyepiece, just like you would if you were viewing through
the telescope.  Then the image from the eyepiece is projected to the film
plane.  So the idea of focusing at infinity doesn't apply much in this case.

Thanks for the note though.

Clear skies,

Roger
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
R o g e r  H e r z l e r
"Imagine if we were all on the same sheet of music...
What a symphony it would be." 

mailto:rherzler@cts.com
herzlers hideout: http://herzler.com
the @stro pages: http://theastropages.com ~ enter the @stro contest!
diegotek web solutions: http://diegotek.com



To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2000 
From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] astrophotography and focusing screens

From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net

For the F models there is a dedicated screen for astrophotography, which
seems to be what you need for this kind of setup to get the best
results. It's not a generally useful screen, however, providing an aerial
image center with parallax crosshairs for focusing accurately. 

Godfrey



From: Sover.Wong@swisscom.com
To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999
Subject: [NikonMF] Re : "Red Dot" Nikon F3 Screens

From: Sover.Wong@swisscom.com

Hej Grant,

The screens on the F are usually 'white dot' - the letters printed on the
metal housing are white, and there is a white dot beside the letters.

The screens on the F2 are usually 'red dot' - the letters printed on the
metal housing are red, and there is a red dot beside the letters.

The screens on the F3 are all 'red dot' - the letters printed on the metal
housing are red, and there is a red dot beside the letters.

I have a white dot H2 screen and a red dot H2 screen. The brightness are
about the same between them, except the white dot H2 screen produces a lot
of fringes (like Newton rings) when a lens slower than f3.5 is attached. The
red dot H2 screen don't have this problem for lenses faster than f5.6.

I have white dot B and a red dot B screen. The brightness are about the same
between them, except the central circle area is etched differently on the
white dot screen, which produces a darker shade when a lens slower than f3.5
is used. The red dot screen doesn't have this problem for all lenses.

I also have white and red dot A screens. as far as I can tell, there is no
difference between them. 

I heard that the F4 screens are brighter than the F3 screens, by about 1/3
stop. There is no meter compensation necessary on the F3, but the required
on the F and F2.


Also, I have a Beattie screen. It is not much brighter than the B screen
(and a lot less than the H2 screen) and it produces dark corners with super
wide angle (20mm) lenses. So avoid this one.

Hope this helps.

Happy shooting,

Sover



To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000
From: Sover.Wong@swisscom.com
Subject: [NikonMF] Re:  Focusing Screens

From: Sover.Wong@swisscom.com

You wrote "If I remove the lip and use it in the F2 I assume it will still
work in the F3 but will simply be a little more difficult to remove.  Is
that correct?  Otherwise I'll get another "U" screen."

Hi Harvey,

Sorry for the late reply. I have been teaching my wife to ski ... with some
success  : )

You are correct. You can prove this by putting an F2 screen in your F3. To
make life a little easier, don't file the complete F3 screen lip off. Just
file about half of it off, and then mount the screen in the F2 with the half
lip pointing towards the lens mount.

I like the R screen, because it has grids like the E screen, and that the
modified central range finder spot is ideal for zoom lenses with a maximum
aperature between f3.5 and f5.6. Also, it's very good for focusing super
wide angle lenses. For fast (50/1.4) lenses, I could still use the central
spot for focusing, contrary to what the Nikon manual said.

I have a Nikkor 50-300/4.5 ED, and I found the H3 screen to be excellent for
this lens. The Nikon manual said that the H2 screen is better, but that's
not my experience. 

Happy shooting,

Sover



From: Sover.Wong@swisscom.com
To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999
Subject: [NikonMF] Re: Re: focusing screens for F3

From: Sover.Wong@swisscom.com

Hi Rich,

A while ago, someone on this or the 'big' Nikon list said that it is
possible to mount F3 screens on an F2, by positioning the lip towards the
lens mount instead of the back. I tried this, and it worked with some of my
F2's but not all (too tight). 

However, it is perfectly OK to use F3 screens on a F2 by filing the lip off.
When you want to do this, you should remove the optics to avoid any metal
bits scratching the optics.

Also, I have been swopping the optics between F, F2 and F3 screens housings.

For the F3, I recommend the H2 screen for general purpose usage. It's the
brightest screen of all - Nikon and Beattie.

Hope this helps.

Happy F3 shooting,

Sover



To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000
From: rlivers@irt.net (Ricky Livers)
Subject: [NikonMF] re: Screen Brightness, F,F2, F3, Beattie

From: rlivers@irt.net (Ricky Livers)

>I am amazed at how much brighter the view looks through some 
>of the newer cameras and wondering if some of  that brightness
>might be available on my F if I put in a later model screen.
[snip]

I wondered the same thing, so I ordered a "B" screen for an F4,
then exchanged it into the F/F2 frame. Yes, it appeared brighter.
I mostly use eyelevel finders. If I were to put my Tn or FTn 
finder on, I would have to make some sort of correction for the
brighter image since the meters are designed to work with the dimmer
screens. Using the Sunny-16 rule on a bright cloudless day, the 

necessary adjustment could be accomplished by changing the ASA 
setting until the rule is satisfied.

You have to use a 100% viewing screen. That means it has to be:
F, F2, F3, F4, F5, etc. Just take the frame apart and exchange 
the fragile screen. I read where some folks alter the F3, F4, F5
frames to fit into their old F's and F2's. I should try that
some time.

Check with KEH, Charlotte Camera, or some of the other places
that specialize in used stuff to find another screen cheap. No
reason to spend a lot of money on an experiment...

Ricky Livers
Tidewater, Virginia



To: "NikonMF" NikonMF@onelist.com
Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2000
From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Screen Brightness, F,F2, F3, Beattie

From: Godfrey DiGiorgi ramarren@bayarea.net

I've not used any of his 35mm screens, but Bill Maxwell's screens for my 
Rolleiflex TLRs are far better and brighter than any of the Beattie 
Intenscreens I've tried. And they remain good focusing surfaces, 
something which is not always the case with the Beatties or some of the 
newer AF SLRs. 

Bill Maxwell
Maxwell Precision Optics
  Work: (404) 244-0095
   Other: (770) 939-6644
P.O. Box 33146
Decatur, GA 30033-0146
USA

Godfrey



Date: Sun, 05 Dec 1999
To: nikon@MailingList.net
From: Mark Malkin mm15@cornell.edu
Subject: Re [NIKON] focusing screens for F3 

I have been using the F4 B or E screens in my F3 for years with no
problems.  Perfect for macro as it is bright, crisp, and sharp all over.
It works wonderfully in my F2AS also!  The F2 focus screen uses a different
mounting frame but the actual insert screens are the same size and have
been since 1959 when the F first was introduced.  The screen inserts can be
interchanged with minor disassembly of the frame giving new viewing ease to
these older cameras.



To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000
From: Grant Goodes ggoodes@ramtex.dk
Subject: [NikonMF] H2 Focusing Screen is Great!

From: Grant Goodes ggoodes@ramtex.dk

Well, at long last I received my H2 focusing screen in the mail
(ordered it to a friend's house in the US to avoid outrageous overseas
shipping, and had him mail it to me).  I must say, I'm impressed.
All of you who raved about this screen were right.  The only thing
that's confusing with these Hx and Gx screens is choosing the right
one for your lens collection.  Generally, the H1/G1 are for ultra
wide-angles, and the H2/G2 for most all other non-telephoto lenses
(below 300mm).  However, my 92/93 Nikon catalog lists "slight
vignetting possible" for my 24/2 with the H2 (though all my other
lenses get an "excellent") and recommends the H1 instead.  I finally 
decided that I'd risk the H2, especially when I found them new at the 
excellent price of $US 20 at this location:


http://www.profotonyc.com/nikon.htm

Anyways, the vignetting is very subtle, if at all noticeable, so
I'm happy enough.  Why would the 24/2 have vignetting on the H2
(NOT with the G2) while the 24/2.8 is fine?  The length of the
lens, and the angle at which the light rays leave the lens is
identical for both lenses.  As I understand it, the differences

between the Hx/Gx screens are in the pitch of the micro-prism
sides, and they are optimised for a certain range of focal lengths.
That max. aperture should matter surprises me!

I look forward to trying out my Noct Nikkor and 25/2 with this
screen in my typical available darkness shooting environment.

Now if I can only find an AS-7 at a decent price, I'll have my
dream F3/T setup more-or-less complete (well, dreaming, I'd have
an OP 10/5.6 fisheye, but thats not very likely, is it..).

grant..



To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 
From: Grant Goodes ggoodes@ramtex.dk
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] H2 Focusing Screen is Great! 

From: Grant Goodes ggoodes@ramtex.dk

rge@adinet.com.uy said:
> I would like to read comparisons of standard focusing screens like
> type B with this screen. Please tell us when you have something about
> it. Results will be different depending on lens and light used. It is
> interesting to know how it performs with bright light too (again, it
> depends on the lens used, especially lens speed).

I also have a K and an E screen (and the E is basically a B + grid) so I can
attempt to make a comparison, but I'm pretty used to the K after 15 years
with my FE2, so I use that one a lot despite the shortcomings of the
split-image in low light.  The E I use mostly for macro work, and although
it's very easy to see when a macro image in good light comes into focus
with the essentially matte fresnel focusing aid, I don't find it that great
with my 24/2 in low light.  I'm hoping that the H2 will become my general
low-light screen, and just looking casually through the viewfinder, I'm
already impressed.

> According to the following websites, Hx isn't exactly equivalent to Gx:

No, they're not, but I was broadly summarizing their characteristics.  It
looks like, from the chart in my Nikon catalog, that the Gx ones are
somewhat more restricted than the Hx.   For example, there's no Gx that
is recommended for the 18/3.5 or 20/2.8 Nikkors!
I think generally, Nikon is very conservative in evaluating screen
recommendations, since these are mostly aimed at demanding pros.  When
they say "Slight vignetting is possible", they mean "slight" and "possible",
not "it looks like crap!

grant.. (who _finally_ won an ebay auction on an AS-7 for less than half
of the B&H; price -- Yippee!).



To: NikonMF@onelist.com
Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000
From: sover.wong@swisscom.com
Subject: [NikonMF] RE: F/F2 screen letters

From: sover.wong@swisscom.com

Hi Peter,

The early F/F2 screens have white letters and the later F2/F3 screens have
red letters to denote some improvements. I guess F/F2 screens with yellow
letters are between the two, and they are quite rare.

I have a white letter/dot H2 screen and a red letter/dot H2 screen. The red
letter H2 screen doesn't produce franges at f4.5 whereas the white letter H2
screen does. I also have white letter/dot A & B screens and red letter/dot A
& B screens, but I can't tell the difference between them.

Happy shooting and selling,

Sover



From: "Curfman, Donald (GXS)" Donald.Curfman@gxs.ge.com
Subject: [NIKON] RE: NIKON is F5 that bad???

Date: Wed, 17 May 2000
To: nikon@photo.cis.to

> >FWIW: There's a spot meter down there too, but it 
> >isn't used if you've got an EC type screen and a 
> >DP-30 on the camera. 
> > Then how does the camera spot meter? 

The EC screens tell the DP-30 which AF
sensor is selected, and it uses the part of it's CCD that corresponds to
that part of the frame. 

That's how it shifts the spot meter around to
follow the selected AF sensor.

Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000
From: Bruce Millman bmillman@yahoo.com
Subject: [NIKON] F5 focusing screen
To: nikon@photo.cis.to

Hello

How odd noone else responded to your question.

I have the G3 focusing screen and use it (primarily) with the 135DC lens. I do think it is a bit brighter and like the microprism in the center however it forces you to use the center spot since the microprism doesn't cover the other spots.

It would be nice if Nikon made the H screen for the F5, guess I will have to buy an F3 for that luxury ;)

There is compensation required (using the custom function) for center weighted metering, presumably because the metering works through the screen in that metering mode only.

There is some vignetting on an 80-200 but very very little (hard to explain, if you look straight on its barely noticeable, but if you view at an angle there is more) and its not perfect on the 135DC.

I know you only asked about the brightness but I couldn't help adding a couple other things, but let me know if you need more information.

Bruce

------- Original Message -----

Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000
From: "Krefeld" krefeld@earthlink.net
Subject: [NIKON] F5 focusing screen

Have any of you used the "G" screens for the F5. Are they brighter than the standard screen?

To: NikonMF@egroups.com
Date: 14-Aug-2000
From: Rodrigo Gimenez rge@adinet.com.uy
Subject: [NikonMF] Focusing Screen F (was F2 focussing screen wanted!)

Alex Hurst wrote:

>Having just received some nice new F2 K screens today (not for sale,
>I'm afraid), I can offer you either an A or an F type.

The F screen is best suited for Reflex lenses.

What differences did you find when compared with standard ground glass screens? (outer area on the A or K; or all the area on the Type B focusing screen).

Is it brighter and/or easier to focus?

Which lenses did you find better to use the F screen?

Rodrigo Gimenez

To: NikonMF@egroups.com
From: Alex Hurst corkflor@iol.ie
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing Screen F (was F2 focussing screen wanted!)

Rodrigo asked

>The F screen is best suited for Reflex lenses.
>What differences did you find when compared with
>standard ground glass screens? (outer area on the A or K;
>or all the area on the Type B focusing screen).
>Is it brighter and/or easier to focus?
>Which lenses did you find better to use the F screen?

That's why I got the K screens, which are equally bright (perhaps because they're brand new), but have a split image spot surrounded by a microprism - a bit like the standard screen on the FM.

It may just be my aging eyes, though I find no problem focusing my Leicaflex SLs, which have an outstandingly bright screen and a very positive central microprism spot.

The screens, BTW, are on their way to Frank today, so he should be back in business by the weekend.

Best
Alex

Personal Website: http://homepages.iol.ie/~corkflor/

To: NikonMF@egroups.com
Date: 15-Aug-2000
From: Rodrigo Gimenez rge@adinet.com.uy
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing Screen F (was F2 focussing screen wanted!)

Alex Hurst wrote:

>Rodrigo - I found the F screen nice and bright, but very hard to
>focus precisely using wide aperture lenses because of the central
>microprism spot.

I think that the focusing screen you are talking about is the J, because the Type F is plain, like the B and U, without microprisms. Maybe you have a J screen on a F frame?

Rodrigo Gimenez

To: NikonMF@egroups.com
From: Alex Hurst corkflor@iol.ie
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2000
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing Screen F (was F2 focussing screen wanted!)

Rodrigo and I wrote:

>  >Rodrigo - I found the F screen nice and bright, but very hard to
>>focus precisely using wide aperture lenses because of the central
>>microprism spot.
>
>I think that the focusing screen you are talking about is the J,
>because the Type F is plain, like the B and U, without microprisms.
>Maybe you have a J screen on a F frame?

Didn't know that could happen.

I quote from Stephen Gandy;

"Type F: Matte field with center microprism spot.

Type J: Center 4mm microprism design, with a 12mm circle outline to indicate centerweighted readings.

Type JA Matte field with center microprism similar to the F screen, except that microprism is smaller at 4mm in diameter."

>From that I'd say it was definitely a type F.

BTW, my 'new' K screens came with a very useful Nikon leaflet which not only describes the various screens, but also has two charts. One helps you select your correct screen/lens combination; the other gives exposure corrections for certain combinations of lens and screen.

The only problem is that you need a magnifying glass to read them!

Best

Alex

--
Alex Hurst
Nr. Cork Ireland

Home website: http://homepages.iol.ie/~corkflor/

To: NikonMF@egroups.com
Date: 15-Aug-2000
From: Rodrigo Gimenez rge@adinet.com.uy
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Focusing Screen F (was F2 focussing screen wanted!)

Alex Hurst wrote:

>I quote from Stephen Gandy;
>
>"Type F: Matte field with center microprism spot.
>
>Type J: Center 4mm microprism design, with a 12mm circle outline to
>indicate centerweighted readings.

That's strange: both the F4 and Nikon Guide brochures say that the Type B, F and U are matte/fresnel; the B is for general use, F is for Reflex (mirror) lenses, while Type U is for lenses with focal length longer than 200mm.

Also, the following sites confirm this:

http://www.ozdoba.net/nikon/nikon_zubehoer_screen.html

But what you say is confirmed at

http://www.cameraquest.com/nfscreen.htm

http://www.mir.com.my/~michaeliu/neoff2/neoff2shared/ff2screens.html

and

http://www.cameraquest.com/nfscreen.htm

Rodrigo Gimenez

To: NikonMF@egroups.com
From: sover wong sover_wong@yahoo.com
Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000
Subject: [NikonMF] Re: Focusing Screen F (was F2 focussing screen wanted!)

Rodrigo wrote "I think that the focusing screen you are talking about is the J, because the Type F is plain without microprisms"

Hi Rodrigo,

Actually the F screen is like the J except the micro prism area is bigger. The size of the circle is between the J and the G screens. For reasons unknow to me, it is not listed in F and F2 manuals. Some people said that the F is designed for long focal lenses, and it's brighter. I suspect using the F screen on the F and F2 bodies would need some exposure compensation like the G series screens.

Happy shooting,

Sover

To: NikonMF@egroups.com
Date: 16-Aug-2000
From: Rodrigo Gimenez rge@adinet.com.uy
Subject: Re: [NikonMF] Re: Focusing Screen F (was F2 focussing screen wanted!)

sover wong wrote:

>Actually the F screen is like the J except the micro
>prism area is bigger. The size of the circle is
>between the J and the G screens.

So one of the websites posted yesterday was wrong, while the other two were right.

What about the outer area?

Is it matte/fresnel too? Is it brighter than others?

Rodrigo Gimenez

To: NikonMF@egroups.com
From: sover wong sover_wong@yahoo.com
Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000
Subject: [NikonMF] Re: Re: Focusing Screen F

Hi Rodrigo,

The outer area of the F screen is matte/fresnel too. I haven't noticed it is any brighter than the others.

Happy shooting,

Sover

From: twm47099@mthtrains.com (Tom)
Newsgroups: rec.photo.equipment.35mm
Subject: Re: Merits of different focusing screens
Date: 29 Apr 2003 

Bill,
Along with my AF camera (Maxxum 7) I have a couple of manual focus
cameras. An SRT 101 (with microprism and fine ground glass center
spot in a mat background)
Two X-570's, one with a split image spot surrounded by a micro prism
ring in a mat background, One with a grid screen with no focusing aids
(possibly a finer grind in the center)
An old Bronica S2 with a waist level finder (magnifying glass, and a
fine ground center spot.

I never liked the micro prism focusing aids. They are supposed to
break up the image when out of focus and then snap into a sharp image
when in focus. Maybe it works for a certain range of Focal lengths,
but I've never been able to get it to be that obvious.

I like the split image spot sometimes, and hate it other times. When
there's bad lighting and vertical lines in the subject, its fine.
When I have a long lens on the camera, unless I have my eye exactly in
the correct spot, it can go black in one half. When doing macros with
a bellows or extension ring or a reversed lens, the entire spot goes
black. Since the primary time I usually want to focus on the subject
in the center of the frame is when I'm doing macro on a tripod, it is
extremely annoying to have the spot go black. That's why I got the
grid screen.

I find I do best (if there is reasonable light)with a plain ground
screen with fine grind (each manufacturer has a different name for it)
in the center. One reason for this may be my experience many years
ago doing photomicroscopy on a metallograph) with an 8x10 ground glass
back. Since at 500x there is not a lot of DOF, focusing had to be
right on. I usually used a focusing telescope and just looked to get
separation and contrast between pairs or groups of the finest features
I could find. I still look for very fine features that go in and out
of focus very sharply. For that I want a bright fine screen. The
X570 has a nice bright screen (not as bright as the 7, but much
brighter than the SRT101.) Even the Bronica screen, is not as dark as
I had feared for a waist level finder.

One big difference I noted between my AF camera and most of the MF
cameras is that there are no reference points in most manual focus
screens. My 7 and your 5 have nice reference marks near the thirds
points which I use to align horizons and verticals. I've had to get
used to using bubble levels with my Manual focus cameras (except for
the X-570 with the grid screen).

Tom

Bill Tuthill ca_creekin@yahoo.com wrote
> I'm getting interested in manual focusing, and realize that my
> autofocus-oriented camera is lousy for this.
>
> Can anybody summarize, or point me to a resource describing,
> the different types of interchangeable focusing screens,
> and the advantages/disadvantages of each? I have used
> ground glass on a TLR and split-screen on an old Canon SLR.
>
> Maybe I'm entering the wrong words, but Google comes up empty.
> Thanks in advance.


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