Josh Kramer's Saint Website
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Due to so much information on the Q And A page, I have placed more interviews here (for the time being). I thought this would be a good idea to help make reading the interviews easier.
Again, these are interviews I have received from Josh Kramer. If you see any interviews that are from your site or another site, please let me know so I can add a link or remove the interview (if it is yours) should you want it removed. Thank you!
El Zelote Interviews Josh Kramer:
El Zelote: Can you tell me about the beginnings of the band?
Josh: In the Beginning: In the late 70's, the core of the band was John Mahan and Richard Lynch. John left the band in 81 or so. They recruited Gene McClendon as the drummer and in 1982-83 recruited me as the lead guitarist to replace Mahan. We desperately searched for a singer but none were to be found so I gave it a try. Rich loved it so I from that moment on was the lead vocalist. We coaxed Mahan to return which he did. Warriors of the Son was born. Churches, Christian radio stations, and Christian record labels turned us away for a while, so we marketed the E.P. ourselves.
We recorded our first EP as "Saint" entitled "Warriors of the Son" in early 1984. In 1986 Saint got airplay on many Christian radio stations throughout the US, and around the world. Saints first full length LP was recorded on the Pure Metal Records Label, entitled "Time's End" It was a groundbreaking album for the band. "Too late for Living" was released in 1988. This release received worldwide notoriety, and is popular to this day.
Our most popular albums "Times End" and "Too Late for Living" mainly focused on an apocalyptic theme. Not many bands would choose this theme to focus on but would focus on Jesus and spiritual battles between the flesh and spirit. With our apocalyptic theme, we were considered by anyone interested in Christian metal to be on the cutting edge of emerging genre.
El Zelote: Was it hard being a Christian band in the 80's
Josh: It was extremely difficult. Rich Lynch has lived in Salem most of his life so this is where we are based. It was very hard to get a job as a long haired hippy freak that wanted to take off every now and then. i built up a load of music students which floated me. The average reaction from the general public towards our image was revulsion. Even now I tried to grow my hair long and got weary of the disrespect from people in general. My hair is very short now and everyone thinks I look respectable.
El Zelote: Your lyrics speak about last times , Why is this your focus? How did it come about?
Josh: We are in the last days. This is a very tense and difficult time for humanity. We found great inspiration from the book of revelation.
El Zelote: Some people consider to Saint like a Legend. How do you think about this.
Josh: We are greatly honored and humbled by this. We of course dreamed of hopefully being a well liked and popular band but when people start calling us and me a legend it sort of makes me feel........not worthy. I'm just me. I grunt and groan through my day, get my mouth washed out with soap by the lord every now and then like everybody else, and I have faults and failings like everybody else. Since we are on this subject, I want people to know that I am a sinner that got saved by the grace of God and I am not perfect yet. You'll know I'm perfect when you see or hear of 6 paul bearers carrying me in a box. If you want to be like anyone, strive to be like Jesus.
El Zelote: Speak us shortly about the separation of the band
Josh: After Too late for living was released, we still were wondering what was going on. The record company gave us the same song and dance as the previous record companies not telling us the truth about how many albums were being sold and kept lying to us telling us that we hadn’t reached recoup level. They never gave us a touring budget, so we rotted, and starved. I wanted to reconnect with family in California, and hook up with Sanctuary South Bay and Pastor Bob Beeman to get an extra needed spiritual refreshing, which I did. I ran short on cash got stranded and got replaced. Fans wondered where the band was or if we were going to release any new material. In 1997, Richard Lynch reissued all three Saint albums on a two CD set. Then in 1999, Saint released the CD entitled "The Perfect Life" which was more of a modern sound with a couple of classic sounding Saint songs. I was married and had long given up on Saint and was losing my grip on God, my marriage and my line of credit. Since I was unable to play on this album as the lead singer due to being in outer space and 2 thousand miles from where Richard was based, I got replaced by Tim Lamberson.
Later in 1999, Saint would work along with M8 Distribution to re-issue Warriors of the Son with The Gentiles demo, Too Late for Living and "Times End" with a live show from Cornerstone 1986. The production of this album was considered very disappointing.
El Zelote: And how born the idea of make this last album "In the Battle"? and what events were happening in your life at that time?
Josh: around 2000-2001 Rich and I struck up a dialog around about the time of my separation with my spouse. Talk about spirit intervention and cozmic timing! He sent me some song ideas on cd and i liked some of them. well into 2002 I was in total emotional and spiritual collapse from my divorce. I was into beer and pot and stopped going to church completely. Rich didn't know this. I started writing a book in 2000 about Nicolas of Myra,(Santo Nicolas). Of all the people in my life at that time who were Christians, one spoke up and told me about her faith and love of Christ, gave me a mini book of the scriptures and witnessed to me. She was one of my music and acting students, I will always consider as a friend, 11 year old Julienne Indy Roberts. Talk about a humbling cold glass of water in my face. I owe my new life in Christ to her, her family and their church that prayed me out of the toilet I was flushing my life into they rescued me with tough love. I knew it was time to make some serious changes. They saw me through some very rough times. With my new anointing, getting baptised, new faith and firm foundation built on Jesus Christ and shedding the layers of addictionsand foolishness, the time to move out west came and off I went. 2 powerful songs were born from the ashes. Full Armor and Cold Day. Cold Day is way too mellow for Saint but I am releasing it as a special solo project along with some other songs that might be way to thrash sounding for Saint in the near future.
El Zelote: Speak shortly about this , You back to heavy roots.
Josh: It's what I was born to do.
El Zelote: I read about of a project to make a Bible for Metal heads, And read the name of Richard Lynch of Saint help in this . You know some about this.
Josh: I'm unaware of this.
El Zelote: What are your future plans?
Josh: To hopefully marry again, be a great husband and papa. Hopefully live long enough to see my grand children.
El Zelote: Your final words for the readers of Sangre Suficiente
Josh: Pray without ceasing, love and forgive one another. Become experts on the subject of repentance. I hope to see you all on tour very soon. God bless you all!!!! Josh Kramer
An Interview With Josh Kramer, by Stefan:
Stefan: Hey Josh! A real pleasure to see you guys are back after a silence of several years. How are you these days and what kept you busy during your absence?
JOSH: I recently finished co-writing an adventure story based on a guy shrouded in myth and legend. It is a story based on factual historic events with licence for creativity and embellishment in an attempt to fill the mysterious gaps surrounding the most famous and misrepresented man of all time. Saint Bishop Nicolas of Myra. The Real deal. It started out in 2000, when I had a wild and weird dream that changed me for ever becoming a journal, then it became a book, then a script and currently what it is today, an audio book rock opera on C.D.R. available through me in both audio wav and mp3 compressed data format. So far it has only gotten favourable reviews. It's not for sale but for what ever aperson can afford, they can have a signed copy. It's there for the asking. In 1988, The members of Saint all went our seperate ways. I needed to spend some much needed time close to my family and link up with Sanctuary South Bay California for fellowship and spiritual guidance. I got stranded down there and Rich needed a singer.
Melodic Christian and Secular Metal was coming to a slow and arthritic crawl in 1989 and so ended the chapter of my life with Saint at that time. just before the release of the 4th album and the day after we played the HIS Festival in California USA.
Many misunderstandings, differing views, no financial compensation from the
record companies contributed to the demise of Saint. I wanted to see my family after many years of being away in addition to the need for camaraderie withfellow believers that were long hairs like me in the Christian Music culture prompted me to go to Southern California to get fellowship with Sanctuary South Bay with Pastor Bob Beeman. I totally loved being there. I met so many great people that welcomed me with open arms and blessed my life. Rich and I lost touch, I got stranded without enough money to return to Salem in time to meet the deadline for the next recording project. Rich had to let me go and find another singer to get the job done.
I got married a couple of years later, became my wife's guitarist and backing vocalist, pursuing at first Secular Pop, then migrated to Nashville TN. to develop her country music career and finally her Christian Pop music career.
We separated 1n 2001 and Rich Lynch and I struck up a dialog to consider reforming Saint. I had no idea how popular we were around the world. My audio book rock opera,"Nicolas" was born in 2000 from a journal which was inspired by a wierd, wild and life changing dream.
I gave away everything revolving around being a home owner including the home to my x-wife, tools, books, furnature, rocks and so forth to students, neighbors and friends then packed everything left over that I owned into the bed of my pickup in December 2002. I then moved out west to reunite with Rich and embark on our newest and most powerful project ever with a new sense of strength and empowerment from on high as lead vocalist, 2nd lead, rhythm guitarist and song writer.
Stefan: Let's start this interview with a question for all those who aren't that familiar with the band. Can you tell me some history information and something about the evolution of SAINT?
JOSH: The band was originally formed by Rich Lynch and John Mahan in the late 70's calling themselves "The Gentiles". At that time, the drummer Gene McClendon whom I've known for a few years prior to joining the band found me in the Air Force in 1982. He let me know that a position was available as lead guitarist for his band. He sent me a Gentiles demo which is available now through Armor Records, (Richard Lynch's Indy label). Rich really liked my guitar demo and we started up a dialog to have me come on board as guitarist.
It was impossible finding a lead singer so I volunteered for the spot having only a light rock folk background vocally having been a big fan of Larry Norman,Keith Green, DeGarmo and Key, Rez band, Phil Keaggy, Kansas, Foreigner, Deep Purple, Randy Stonehill, Hendrix, 2nd Chapter of Acts, Petra, Tom Petty, BobDylan, Classical music, Jazz favourites and some old country artists and soforth.
Rich and Gene introduced me to Great artists such as Ronnie James Dio, Ozzy, Black Sabbath, Priest, Accept and my guitar students introduced me to a plethora of a the current heavy bands like Slayer, Metallica, Megadeth, Anthrax etc. We eventually voted on a new name. "Saint". I thought it was too religious sounding. I guess the Lord had bigger thoughts than me. We got John Mahan to rejoin the band and Warriors of the Son was born.
As the new vocalist, we opted to refrain from having me do any guitar work and just keep me in the vocal spot so that I could focus on the audience and a guitar playing lead singer was not the image we were looking for at the time.
To this day, we are going to maintain that I focus on mainly vocals and some leads as well as some rhythms to back up Jerry Johnson who is a masterful guitarist.
Stefan: Tell me a bit more about yourself Josh, how you got into making Metal music, and why you chose to raise up a Christian Metal band? Do you have some religious backgrounds?
JOSH: My musical background is vast. I love Classical guitar and all forms of well made music what ever style. Metal music is very Classical influenced when it is donewell. Ingwie Malmsteen Joe Satriani, Steve Vai, Alan Holdsworth and Frank Zappa are classic examples of amazingly complex classical and jazz influenced greats. I was born baptised and raised Catholic and modulated intoand out of various religions over the years. For the sake of privacy, I wish to refrain from disclosing my particular religious affiliation at this time. The marriage of metal music and God was inevitable and was what I was born to do. I've heard it said that there is no such thing as Christian music, only Christian Lyrics.
Stefan: I think that SAINT was one of the very first Christian Metal bands ever. Later on we had bands like Deadly Blessing, Angelica, Stryper, Sacred Warrior,....
JOSH: We were trailblazers alright and paid the price for it. The actual real Christian Real original pioneer Rockers were and still are in my opinion are Rez band and...nope that's all that comes to mind. Rez band.
Stefan: What is your honest meaning about the Black or Death Metal scene of today? As a Christian Metal musician, can you show some respect to this forms of Metal or not Josh?
JOSH: I am so out of touch with the metal scene today (shame on me!). I respect the hard work, sacrifice and heart of these young and old men to play the music they love. If they are not bringing glory to Christ then they are only missing out on the truest joy of creativity in song. Sad to say it is their loss. I am no ones judge. I can only look at my own life and see where I am lacking. The log that is lodged in my eye gets in the way of being able to see the splinter in my fellow human's eye. If I judge my fellow human, I am judged in the same measure. I've heard it said that we are un fit to receive the blessed sacrament elements of communion (the bread and cup) when there is unforgiveness in our hearts towards anyone. That makes hypocrites out of a lot of folks. I'm not immune to this sin of unforgiveness either.
Stefan: We're talking about the mighty and glorious Metal period. What's for you the biggest difference between then and now. When I look back to the 80s scene, a lot of things are totally changed, right?
JOSH: The hair.The hair is missing. I would love to have big hair again and perhaps I will some day. The tones available in amp rigs and processing gear is so much more diverse and powerful now. Music styles seem to be going retro and the music that was new to us in the 80's is new to a whole new generation.
Stefan: The most beautiful experience you'll never forget during your SAINT career was...?
JOSH: Sitting next to Glen Keizer back stage at Cornerstone festival with his hand on my shoulder with my face in my hands feeling like I was sitting next to the closest thing to a personage of Jesus Christ, humbled and seeking for a touch of the Holy Ghost to answer my prayers for guidance and repentance for my sins.
Seeing the sea of faces that were thrilled to be there and offer their love and support to us as we played in the different places around the U.S.
Stefan: Do you feel comfortable among the new generation of today's Heavy Metal scene?
JOSH: Frankly I sometimes feel quite intimidated and old fashioned next to them. If they recognize me and show me respect for our accomplishments it puts me at more ease. I feel somewhat out of place sometimes. I've been out of touch with the metal music scene for so long it's almost alien to me.
Stefan: You guys are the proud owners of a few great Metal albums, right. Your first release was backthen in 1984, is that correct or not Josh? Please, tell the Metal To Infinity readers also a bit more about all the other killer albums if that's possible.
JOSH: Warriors of The Son, Times End, Too Late for Living and In the Battle are the 4 albums I've had the privilege of participating on as the lead screamer on and sometimes off pitch. I played Rhythm guitar on "The War is Over and feel honoured to be able to play next to and along with the most creative and aggressive guitarists I've ever known personally. Jerry Johnson, John Mahan and Dee Harrington. I played all the guitar work on Acid Rain and Full Armor. I had the privilage to share the rhythm and lead work with Jerry Johnson who is a masterful player. Having Rich Lynch produce me is a total honour because he has a natural metal sense and brings out my very best in the studio in addition to being the primary song writer for Saint. There was a time when I would stand in awe watching John Perrine play the drums like a master. He played as naturally as breathing. Larry London is a remarkable drummer and whipped the songs outwithin only a few days practice with a drum machine clictrack and scratch padvocals and guitars. He nailed all the songs within afew hours. Truly amazing.
Stefan: Every timeI listen to some SAINT songs, Rob Halford and Judas Priest lingers on in my head. Are you agree with that statement?
JOSH: There is some influence there but I am no where near the unbelievable ability that Mr. Halford possesses. Comparing me to him is like comparing me as a little Cessna singleprop airplane and Mr. Halford as a Space shuttle. To me I don't see the comparison. I sound perhaps if there were a comparison to be drawn, to Jim Morrison with a wide range, mix a little Dio, Halford and some Hank Williams Sr.....kidding..in addition to the natural stuff God gave me and we get...me.
Stefan: As I said before being real pleased to hear SAINT is back to brings us some more Metal after so many years of silence. How's the current line up?
JOSH: So far it's Jerry Johnson, Rich and me. We are praying for another guitarist to carry the load and a drummer that can fill the shoes of all of the great drummers we've had the privilege of playing with us. That won't be easy.
Stefan: A new album is available right now so tell me what we can expect. Some information about the title, record company, lyrics,...
JOSH: Our newest project is called, "In the Battle". The Record label is an indy label owned by Rich Lynch. The title depicts the times we are in at present. Our human rat race has always been at war with it's self. The only difference between us and the early humans is that we've devised more efficient ways to kill as many people in one stroke or turn of a key as possible with the use of fire. Makes you wonder how it's all going to end eh? The album cover as usual offends a lot of people being a bit explosive to say the least. ardiddyardiddyar!!! The lyrics in some of the songs are almost praise songs. Some songs are warnings, awakenings and your basic cold glass of water in the face.
Stefan: Any touring plans to promote that new release, hopefully on Belgian grounds too?
JOSH: I am like a racehorse at the gate chomping at the bit to blast off and touch as many peopleas I can. All of us are. When i said to you , "it's all about money" what i'm trying to say here is that the cost's to tour are so unbeleavebly high that without a solid financial launching pad, nobody goes anywhere. A tour bus and a driver, flying from location to location, hotels, food, advertising the show, radio spots, not to mention the families needs of the artists. (My needs are few but i do have them).
It is everyones dream who plays music to be able to do what they love, quit their day job and live their dream of playing their music as a career.
It is certainly my dream. Back in the 80's, fans wrote to me saying things like..."Josh, tell me what it's like to be a rich, world famous rock star. Do you have a mansion? Sports car? Babes?"...and so forth.
I hate bursting anyones bubble of lofty images of grandure but here is the hard cold truth and reality. We never made much money aside from what the record companies gave us to record the projects. I stand corrected on money received. I remember getting 13 dollars for too late for giving as a royalty check, Rich got not much more than that. John Mahan and Dee Harrington vanished and their 20 or so bucks is still sitting in an account somewhere waiting for them to claim it. We were given not more than 10.000 dollars per album as a budget. Most major bands spent that much such on reels of tape. We were basically broke and starving.
I Was at times homeless living in my tent or sharing a crouded apartment with a bunch of single guys from church, sacrificing steady decient paying employment to do sporadic appearences here and there. When my music student load was decient and i got a live in job as a gardner and classical guitar entertainment for special guests for a bed and breakfast. I then had a nice roof over my head but not from my labours with Saint. We made huge sacrifices to do our music. At times, we paid to play our music. I love our fans. I would love to see them all and shake all hands thanking them for their faithful support. I pray that some day this dream will come true.
Stefan: Well, that's about it Josh.Thanks over and over again man answering these questions. If you have something to add, this is the time and place!
JOSH: Fight the good fight! Don't cease in doing good. Make right choices that will determine your destiny. Progress towards perfection. Forgive one another. Study to show your self approved to God. Ask yourself, "What would Jesus do if he were faced with this temptation or situation?" Above all, Love one another. Without love, our religion, whatever persuasion is as a klanging cymbal, a noisy gong, a sounding brass and is worthless. I love all of our dear Saint fans. So many of you have written to me and have been my islands in the storm, my social life, my comfort, my advisors, pen pals and dearest of friends. With out you, Saint would still be struggling in the garage annoying the neighbours. Now we get to annoy the neighbours through our fans who want to play our music as loud as they can where ever they are on this little fragile ball of dirt we affectionately call Earth...bless your metal lovin hearts every one of you and you know who you are. www.saintsite.com sincerely in the love and grace of Jesus Christ, Josh Kramer...H.J.K
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