Pitchfork

I challenge you to find a live photo of Brooklyn-based indie-pop duo Matt and Kim in which neither Matt nor Kim is beaming. Not just smiling-- beaming. Like they just stole the world's biggest gobstopper. The grins are infectious, apparently-- the couple have been spreading toothy, feel-good vibes to bigger and bigger crowds for a couple years in support of their self-titled 2006 debut. Their second album, Grand is out on Fader Label this Tuesday, January 20. Typified by buoyant single "Daylight", the new songs will likely elicit even more deliriousness when Matt and Kim hit the road with Cut Copy this spring.

But it's not all googly eyes and super cute videos for this pair. As a DIY-bred band trying to stay afloat and build an audience in 2009, there are lots of tough choices to make. Raise ticket prices or hook up with corporate sponsors? Indie or major? Floor or stage? In this interview, singer-keyboardist Matt Johnson talks about the conundrums facing indie bands aiming to make a decent living while retaining some semblance of credibility. He also tells us about a meeting with the sage-like Rick Rubin, his secret to beatific happiness, and why Matt and Kim recorded Grand in his parents' house.

Matt Johnson: Hi! I just ate a peanut butter and jelly sandwich and a Red Bull.

Pitchfork: Wow. I've never combined those two.

MJ: This was my first experiment with it. It's a killer combination. Just don't do it too early in the morning.

Pitchfork: Noted. Well, this is kinda Red Bull-related: Are you guys always so upbeat?

MJ: We have our ups and downs, but it's not just a stage persona. I think there was a time when looking bored on stage was the thing to do. But that's totally not honest and extremely boring to watch.

Pitchfork: So you're not just hopped-up on Red Bull and PB&J-type stuff all the time?

MJ: There's some of that involved in the a.m. hours. We've been making an effort to not wear ourselves out-- there are bands who have good stuff go their way and then they overdo it and don't like it.

Pitchfork: Speaking of stuff going your way, I wanted to ask about the corporate sponsorships you guys are involved with, like Converse and Mountain Dew's Green Label Sound. Do you guys worry about credibility when you're asked to do those kinds of things?

MJ: We thought a hell of a lot about it, especially since we came from the DIY circuit where a lot of the people are opinionated about that sort of thing. We did a Virgin Mobile campaign in Canada and people came up to us and said, "I used to DJ your song but I'll never put it on again." When you take something that people think is theirs and connect it to some big corporation...that type of negative reaction makes sense to me. When I was a teenager and really into political punk I would definitely turn my back on a band that connected with some corporation.

But, on the other hand, we're really making an effort not to bring up ticket prices even as touring becomes more expensive. With the Green Label Sound thing, they were willing to do a marketing campaign and pay for us to do all these five-dollar shows with the Cool Kids, who we really like. We couldn't see how that was hurting anybody.

Pitchfork: Lots of indie bands in the 80s and 90s turned down most of those types of offers, though. Do you think there's been an evolution of the idea of selling out?

MJ: It's definitely a different world now. You're not selling records. The idea of actually getting money back from releasing an album is a complete surprise to me. So you have to be open to other opportunities...but it's a slippery slope. Still, I wouldn't foresee any Camel-sponsored tours-- I wouldn't do anything with a company like that.

Pitchfork: Do you have to like the product to team up with a company?

MJ: I'm not a Mountain Dew drinker so I guess it's not necessarily what I do or don't like. But the plan they laid out was very tasteful. It wasn't like a big Mountain Dew logo over and Kim and my faces [laughs]. At the end of the day they're just trying to sell more of their product. But at the same time, they are supporting the arts. If you're willing to do it elegantly I think it helps both parties.

Bizarrely enough, I had a conversation with Rick Rubin about something very similar-- not to just drop names or whatever! This was years ago and we still had an outlook like, "Man, I love how Fugazi had their five-dollar-show rule." And Rick said, "I knew Ian MacKaye well and I know that one of the reasons Fugazi had to stop touring was because they kept their ticket prices so low and, since they got families and stuff, it didn't really work anymore."

And I know plenty of bands-- even Kim and I-- that have a passionate thing about playing on the floor instead of on the stage, like Lightning Bolt. You do it because when you start out you don't want to be exclusive like, "Oh, we're the band and you're the crowd." But when you're playing to 500 people...I mean, I don't go to see Lightning Bolt anymore. I enjoy watching Brian Chippendale play the drums...but I can't see him. I get it: When you're used to only seeing the first 15 people and those first 15 people are the ones going craziest then it's much more comfortable for you. But playing on stage is really putting yourself on the line.

Pitchfork: Tell me a little bit more about Rick Rubin, was he trying to get you to sign with Columbia Records?

MJ: Yeah, he came by our show at the Smell in L.A. I was awed to meet someone like that but we found our relationship wouldn't really work out with him at Columbia. We ended up chatting about music more than anything else.

Pitchfork: So Rick Rubin just showed up at the Smell?

MJ: Well, yeah [laughs]. I remember we put him on our guest list. It was like: Our friend Kim...some guy named Will...Rick Rubin [laughs]. I felt like we were just throwing a fake name on there.

Pitchfork: Were there any weird luxurious-major-label-type moments when you were shopping around?

MJ: A white limousine came to pick us up once, but you go to these big label offices in Manhattan and it's desolate-- there's not even a receptionist.

Pitchfork: You signed with Fader Label for your new album Grand. What made you go with them?

MJ: We just wanted an outlet to do whatever the fuck we wanted to do. And at Fader it just seemed like if I wanted to write a damn book they could help me publish it. We don't want to play a bunch of horrible in-stores just to try and sell more albums...not that we're against selling albums! [laughs] But we didn't want that to be the total backbone.

Pitchfork: So you recorded Grand in the house you grew up in...

MJ: Yeah, in Vermont. It's still my parents' house.

Pitchfork: Um, why?

MJ: We recorded our last record at a studio in L.A. in nine days. It was basically just like, "Ok, good enough, move on." I wanted this to be the opposite experience. I thought about my high school punk band when we recorded in my bedroom. We just figured it out as we went along. Everything on the first album sounded so sterile to me-- I tried to get the producer to make it sound shittier in a way. But then I was like: "I can make this sound shittier if I did it myself!"

Pitchfork: Were you living in the house while you were recording the album?

MJ: Yeah. After six weeks Kim started losing her mind. We had to leave. It was like The Shining-- all work and no play makes Kim a dull girl. And then I reminded her that I had to live there for 18 years!

Matt and Kim tour dates:

01-22 Brooklyn, NY - Music Hall of Williamsburg
01-28 Vancouver, British Columbia - Biltmore Cabaret
01-29 Seattle, WA - Chop Suey *
01-30 Portland, OR - Backspace *
02-01 Sacramento, CA - The Fungarden !
02-02 San Francisco, CA - Cafe Du Nord !
02-04 Los Angeles, CA - Troubadour %
02-07 La Jolla, CA - The Loft %
02-26 Baltimore, MD - Ottobar $
02-27 Columbus, OH - The Summit $
02-28 Louisville, KY - Skull Alley $
03-01 Knoxville, TN - Pilot Light $
03-03 Birmingham, AL - Bottletree
03-04 Baton Rouge, LA - Spanish Moon
03-06 Austin, TX - Stubb's BBQ #
03-07 Dallas, TX - Granada Theatre #
03-09 Pomona, CA - The Glass House #
03-10 Los Angeles, CA - Henry Fonda Theater #
03-11 Los Angeles, CA - Henry Fonda Theater #
03-12 San Francisco, CA - The Fillmore #
03-13 Las Vegas, NV - House of Blues #
03-15 Denver, CO - Bluebird Theatre #
03-17 St. Louis, MO - The Gargoyle #
03-18 Chicago, IL - Vic Theatre #
03-20 Toronto, Ontario - Circa #
03-21 New York, NY - Terminal 5 #
03-22 Boston, MA - House of Blues #
03-23 Washington, DC - The 9:30 Club #
03-24 Carrboro, NC - Cat's Cradle #
03-26 Atlanta, GA - Masquerade #
03-27 Orlando, FL - Club Firestone #
03-28 Miami, FL - Churchills Pub
03-29 Tampa, FL - Transitions Art Gallery
03-30 Tallahassee, FL - Club Downunder
03-31 Gainesville, FL - Common Grounds
04-01 Athens, GA - 40 Watt Club
04-02 Asheville, NC - Emerald Lounge
04-03 Richmond, VA - Canal Club

* with Champage Champagne
! with Hawnay Troof
% with the Mae Shi
$ with Hollywood Holt
# with Cut Copy