Brooks Wackerman for Bad Religion
By Erin Broadley
Mar 31, 2008
Close your eyes and imagine you’re on stage, pounding away at the drums, sweat dripping down your face while dressed in costume as some sort of Colonel Sanders from Hell. You peer into the audience and spy none other than Dave Grohl and Eddie Van Halen munching from the same bag of popcorn, watching you, watching them, enjoying every minute like some sort of rock and roll carnival. “That [was] surreal,” laughs drummer Brooks Wackerman. “That doesn’t happen everyday.”
For the past year and a half, drummer Brooks Wackerman has been leading a dual existence. On one hand he’s been playing drums in character as Colonel Sanders for Tenacious D, and on the other, he’s the drummer for iconic punk band Bad Religion, his primary gig since 2001. Twenty-eight-years since the band formed in Los Angeles, Bad Religion released its 14th studio album New Maps of Hell (Epitaph) in 2007 and is still tearing it up on the road, on tour in support.
SuicideGirls caught up with Brooks Wackerman on the phone from San Diego to chat about Tenacious D and the tenacity of Bad Religion, a band that defines punk rock staying power.
Erin Broadley: New Maps of Hell came out in 2007 and you guys are still touring it. How’s it going? You guys recorded with producer Joe Barresi, right?
Brooks Wackerman: Oh yeah, Joe. Evil Joe.
EB:
[Laughs] Evil Joe?
BW:
[Laughs] New Maps of Hell is Joe’s second album with us and he’s my favorite. He’s a man of few words but when he does speak it’s like, “Wow, you’re right. You’re totally right!” [Laughs]
EB:
He’s definitely someone known for only working with bands that he truly loves.
BW:
Yeah, and he works with one of my favorite bands, Tool, so he has my endorsement. He’s great. He gets the best drum sounds for me on any records I’ve worked on.
EB:
I read that you adopted a new drum recording technique from him that he also used with Queens of the Stone Age. What was it?
BW:
Yeah, every record that Queens [makes], the drummer -- whether its Dave Grohl or Joey Castillo -- they always record without cymbals at first. Not to get too technical, but the reason they do that is so there is isolation between the cymbals and the drums and the drums will actually sound bigger. I’ve never recorded that way before so it felt a little off at first; I was air drumming on my cymbal stands [laughs]. I just got used to it after awhile.
EB:
It must be cool though for someone like you, playing drums your entire life, to still be able to find new techniques to surprise yourself.
BW:
Yeah, that was definitely one way to do that. We overdubbed the cymbals later on and the result pretty much spoke for itself. But that’s my example of his genius and his always thinking outside the box and coming up with new ideas. That’s why I love working with him.
EB:
You’ve been playing drums your whole life and been in other notable punk bands like Suicidal Tendencies, but I read that you started playing drums before you could even walk.
BW:
Yep. My dad is a music teacher and was actually my junior high and high school jazz band teacher so, I can’t remember because I was so young, but according to my parents, before I started walking, that’s when they put sticks in my hands and I started playing. I basically just grew up around it. I have three brothers and all of them are musicians; one’s a bass player, two are drummers. My brother Chad has played with everyone from Frank Zappa to Men at Work, back in the day. So I would always go out to his shows and I just fell into it. I started taking lessons around five or six-years-old and started playing in bands and made a career out of it, luckily.
EB:
Making a career out of beating the shit out of something…
BW:
[Laughs] Yeah!
EB:
Not a lot of people can say that and not end up in jail!
BW:
[Laughs] Yeah. I surprise myself with what one can get away with.
EB:
Now, you’ve been with Bad Religion since 2001. How did you transition to playing with Bad Religion, coming from Suicidal Tendencies and the Vandals before?
BW:
The dynamic is completely different, personality-wise and musically. At the time when I quit Suicidal I was definitely looking for a different type of musical style so, to me, Bad Religion’s music is more musical with the harmonies and it’s still punk rock but it definitely has a sense of melody that some of my other bands I’ve been in didn’t. I think I was attracted to that. It’s just a different animal. At the time I needed to transition to something a little bit more challenging and this is what I found.
EB:
Well, going back to the ‘80s, Bad Religion was, and still is, considered by many to be the band that revived Southern California punk. What was the musical atmosphere back like then and what do you think keeps the band relevant today?
BW:
Right. Well, obviously when people bring up Bad Religion they always bring up the lyrical content. I think what they were singing about when they formed in 1980/1981 is still relevant now, whether it’s politics or psychology or geometry [laughs] … It’s all relevant now. I think that’s what stood out with Bad Religion and yeah, there were some other bands that were screaming about the same things, but I think the music combined with the substance of the lyrics allow for the longevity of this band.
EB:
What are some of the biggest changes you’ve noticed in the Southern California punk scene since you started playing in bands?
BW:
That you can find a punk record in the top ten of Billboard [laughs]. I mean, who would have thought when punk started in the late ‘70s that Green Day would have the number one album for 100 weeks? It’s great, I mean, I love Green Day and I think there will always be underground scenes, but now that it’s mainstream that’s a sign of growth in the style.
EB:
When people put a label on a band like “leaders of the punk revival” do you think that it adds unneeded pressure on a band? Like, after Bad Religion came out with Suffer everyone was talking about how it “saved” the punk scene.
BW:
Yeah, I think there’s that classic story of a band makes a record and, I mean, Suffer wasn’t the first Bad Religion record but it was the first Bad Religion record that got all the notoriety. And then the classic question is, “Is the band going to live up to their [previous] release?” These guys are great, they said a lot on their first records. So yeah, I think there is an undeniable, underlying pressure there.
EB:
The last interview [Bad Religion singer] Greg Graffin did with SuicideGirls, he mentioned how the band still hasn’t released its masterpiece yet.
BW:
[Laughs]
EB:
Well, at this point when your masterpiece does come, you guys have stuck it out long enough and proven you’re here to stay… I wouldn’t worry about the Bad Religion collapsing under the pressure [laughs]. Another thing Greg said about the spirit of Southern California punk was that it has always been the opposite of anarchy… more about building something with lasting value rather than destroying something. He talked about how Bad Religion is about something different than disorder and chaos, which he attributed more to the punk scene overseas or in San Francisco.
BW:
Right, right. Obviously there is a fine distinction between English punk and California punk, anarchy being one of them. Also the sound; It’s definitely a style difference too. But yeah, I’ll be up on stage and look at these kids moshing in the pit just thinking, “I can’t believe you’re actually running into people for fun.” I would never do that [laughs] but I understand the lifestyle. I’m all about unifying our fans and [punk has] come a long way since 1977. I love where it’s at right now. I talk to the fans after shows every night. We definitely know our people. Luckily a lot of our fans are really intelligent and if a kid comes to mosh at our shows, it’s not that he necessarily doesn’t listen to the lyrics. So, again, it’s interesting to see the different types of punkers out there and different categories of punk music.
EB:
I know Greg has always stressed that the development of the mind is just as important as the performance. It’s pretty cool that you guys have been able to sustain that message over the years. How do you guys make sure that it stays important?
BW:
I think what Greg and Brett [Gurewitz] were writing about back then is obviously still relevant today and the topics they hit upon aren’t like, “Lets go believe in anarchy and fuck shit up.” I think when Bad Religion first started, people were like, “Wow, they’re actually talking about issues that other bands haven’t talked about.” A lot of ignorant people will laugh and go, “You guys are anti-Christian,” because of the cross logo, but we’re the farthest thing from that. We just promote questioning authority.
EB:
What’s amazing is how easily people confuse questioning something with rallying against or being anti-something.
BW:
Right. And I know when they came up with the cross poster, people identified with questioning religion, questioning politicians, questioning everything. I think the biggest misconception is that we’re anti-religion. We just want people to go, “Okay, maybe this isn’t true. Maybe this person isn’t right. Maybe I want to go down this other path instead of just saying, ‘Okay you’re right; I’m going to be brainwashed by you.’” [Laughs]
EB:
With the issues, lyrics and subjects Bad Religion touches on still being relevant all these years later, isn’t that a bummer that it hasn’t changed? Wouldn’t you have rather the issues had changed at least a little?
BW:
You would think, right? What’s amazing about that is it is the same fight. Obviously there has been growth and some change, but definitely with the Bush administration and everything that has gone on with the Iraq war, it’s all pretty relevant. We get a lot of college kids as fans with Greg’s [work in education] so we’re always known as the “intelligent rock band” …
EB:
[Laughs] As if you can’t be intelligent and be in a band…
BW:
[Laughs] Yeah, It’s so funny. Greg came to sound check the other day and he was totally dressed up from his lecture, you know, button down shirt, nice slacks and I was like, “Greg why did you dress up for sound check?” And he’s all, “Oh, I just got done doing a four-hour lecture at UCLA.” Like, wow, I can honestly say I have never been in a band with a guy that just came from a four-hour lecture.
EB:
I can honestly say I’ve never sat through a four-hour lecture [laughs].
BW:
[Laughs] Yeah. Before I joined the band, I definitely didn’t think the way that I do now so that’s something I take as personally what I’ve learned just being in this band and learning about topics that I never would have thought about before. It’s been an interesting ride.
EB:
Well, you guys have definitely been committed to a specific cause over the course of the band’s career. Even with rotating members, the core of what the band is about has remained intact, but hopefully without being redundant.
BW:
Yeah, I mean musically it has evolved over the years and I think commitment in general is hard to do, to really be tenacious with something and to make a career out of it and to practice it, whether you’re doctor or musician or whatever. I think anybody battles with that, just being consistent with what you really want to do in life. What I found fascinating about this band before I joined was just the different elements and that everyone in this band has such a strong personality. That’s what attracted me to this band because it’s very democratic with everything that we do. Everyone has a strong opinion, whether it’s a touring schedule or set lists or just the normal shit that bands go through.
EB:
You’ve also maintained your own distinct personality you’ve got a lot of other musical projects going on as well. You’ve also been drumming for Tenacious D, which you described as musical theater. What was the Tenacious D tour like?
BW:
It was pretty much the antithesis of what a Bad Religion tour would be like.
EB:
Were you playing a character?
BW:
I was a character. I was Colonel Sanders. I won’t go too deep into the show because you have to see it to understand why I play the role of Colonel Sanders, but, in a nutshell, we all die on-stage. Basically, each member of the band had to be someone that went to hell for a particular reason. And I was Colonel Sanders and the reason I went to hell was because I killed over a billion chickens [laughs]. Jack [Black] obviously brainstormed everything and he emailed me about it and I said, “I’d be honored to be Colonel Sanders for the next year.”
EB:
[Laughs] Did you do a lot of research for your role?
BW:
Are you familiar with Neil Hamburger, the comedian?
EB:
Yes.
BW:
He’s a good friend of Jack’s so he came out on tour with us. I think he was fascinated by the fact that I was Colonel Sanders so for my birthday he gave me a book, the biography on Colonel Sanders. I think it was called Finger Licking Good. [Laughs] I’m a method actor; I do extensive research before I play my roles. So yeah, I was Colonel Sanders for about a year, year and a half give or take. It was great. A lot of the show was based on scenes from their movie Pick of Destiny so that’s why I compare it to a theater show. They would come out and do like 20 minutes acoustically and then Kyle would electrocute himself and die on stage and that’s when we came out. Our bass player was Charlie Chaplin and went to hell for being gay.
EB:
Didn’t Dave Grohl play Satan in the movie Pick of Destiny?
BW:
Yeah. Actually, when we played L.A. he was in the audience with Eddie Van Halen and they were eating popcorn together while they watched the show. That’s surreal. That doesn’t happen everyday.
EB:
Well you’ve got some other projects going on. You’ve got your band Kidneys where you play guitar and sing and one of your brothers is on drums, right?
BW:
Yeah, my brother John plays drums in Kidneys. He’s a fantastic drummer, and then John Spiker who plays bass in Tenacious D with me, plays bass in Kidneys. We’re a power trio.
EB:
What are your plans with Kidneys? You describe it as “muso-pop”…
BW:
Muso-pop. Everyone kept on asking me, “Okay, well what does it sound like?” And the only thing I could come up with is the genre that I’m so proud to say I’ve created called muso-pop. Basically, if you’re a muso, as in you’re really into different styles of music, or you’re a musician, I think you can appreciate the musical part of it, the musicianship in the band. But it’s not so muso where there’s not a pop sensibility.
EB:
So it’s not too technical and heady. It’s accessible to more than just musicians.
BW:
Exactly. Yes. We get tech-y at times but then we also have a hook here and there. I think people that like pop music or more mainstream stuff could get into some of our songs. That’s my goal at least. The foundation is rock but we definitely take detours. I probably started recording it about five years ago so I think every half-decade I’ll release a new Kidneys record [laughs]. I love songwriting and wrote all the songs on it and, this year when I have some down time, I’m going to do some gigs and some mini-tours here and there.
EB:
How is it being a frontman, going from being in the back as a drummer to front and center as a singer?
BW:
It was challenging.
EB:
It’s harder to dodge things that people throw at you.
BW:
Yeah [laughs]. I don’t have as many items to hide behind. It was definitely challenging. I was in another band I formed called Hot Potty before where I was singing and playing guitar as well. I remember the first time I went up on stage as a guitar player/vocalist and I was scared shitless. It just felt so weird because I’m like, “Where’s my drum set?” [Laughs] But I’m at the point now where its second nature but yeah, I’m always trying to be a better singer and everything so I think I still have a long road ahead of me.
Bad Religion is on tour now. For more information go to www.badreligion.com and www.myspace.com/badreligion. Also check out Brooks’ band Kidneys at www.myspace.com/kidneys.
Bad Religion is on tour now. For more information go to www.badreligion.com and www.myspace.com/badreligion. Also check out Brooks’ band Kidneys at www.myspace.com/kidneys.
